Discuss the Ghostbusters movie that was released in 2016.
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By Alphagaia
#4881088
MagicPrime wrote:
Just because one types them online doesn't turn your opinions into facts.
A thing both sides can learn from. Let's all show we can be adults about this and keep the mudslinging out of this thread.
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By JurorNo.2
#4881112
Alphagaia wrote:
MagicPrime wrote:
Just because one types them online doesn't turn your opinions into facts.
A thing both sides can learn from. Let's all show we can be adults about this and keep the mudslinging out of this thread.
Well I can understand the initial discussion has run its course. I'll have to come up with a new comparison. ;)
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By JurorNo.2
#4881114
Looks like I'll have to repeat what I said earlier: I do wonder why we praise the subtlety and class of GB84, but then go so, I don't know, 5th grade with criticism of the reboot. You'd think GB fans would draw more on the biting wit of GB84 (and I'll include GB89 as well), but no, it's typical fanboy stuff. Interesting.
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By timeware
#4881125
Next round of discussion. What are the major differences between proton pack technology from both films?
By Skyknight
#4881191
timeware wrote:Next round of discussion. What are the major differences between proton pack technology from both films?
The biggest difference between the packs is of course that they use a syncrotron instead of a cyclotron to accellerate the particles, like it was pointed out in the tech video!

But I have to point out that the development of the new packs feels a bit forced to me. Like it happens way too fast.

The original movie seemed like it was covering a long span of time while the new one looks like it's all happening within a week.
In the '84 movie it took them some time before they could open business. After they were removed from the college, they had to get a mortgage from the bank to buy the firehouse which usually takes some weeks to go through. Then they had to do major repairs to the building, which also would've taken some time. They had seen the ghost of the librarian and have taken measures from her, before they were evicted from college. So Egon had quite some time to come up with theoretics for the pack and build it, before they opened business.

Now, if we look at the new movie, they see the ghost in the Eldridge Mansion and find one of Rowan's devices, meaning that his plan is already in full swing. Then they're forced out of college and don't have the money to rent the firehouse much less the safeties to get a loan to buy some property and go to the chinese place immediately. They haven't even moved in completely before Patty appears and takes them to the subway station, but magically Holtzmann already has a pack prototype ready by the time they get there. When the hell did she build that thing?
And also she comes up with a new part or improvement after every job they take. Seems like she had already build the parts before the movie even starts and now just slaps them together to test which combination of parts works the best. But that makes no sense, because they had not seen a ghost before they got to the mansion and had no measurements to base the tech on before.

I really like the new packs but to me it felt like they're developing too fast in a too short period of time.
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By JurorNo.2
#4881200
Skyknight wrote:
timeware wrote:Next round of discussion. What are the major differences between proton pack technology from both films?
The biggest difference between the packs is of course that they use a syncrotron instead of a cyclotron to accellerate the particles, like it was pointed out in the tech video!

But I have to point out that the development of the new packs feels a bit forced to me. Like it happens way too fast.

The original movie seemed like it was covering a long span of time while the new one looks like it's all happening within a week.
In the '84 movie it took them some time before they could open business. After they were removed from the college, they had to get a mortgage from the bank to buy the firehouse which usually takes some weeks to go through. Then they had to do major repairs to the building, which also would've taken some time. They had seen the ghost of the librarian and have taken measures from her, before they were evicted from college. So Egon had quite some time to come up with theoretics for the pack and build it, before they opened business.

Now, if we look at the new movie, they see the ghost in the Eldridge Mansion and find one of Rowan's devices, meaning that his plan is already in full swing. Then they're forced out of college and don't have the money to rent the firehouse much less the safeties to get a loan to buy some property and go to the chinese place immediately. They haven't even moved in completely before Patty appears and takes them to the subway station, but magically Holtzmann already has a pack prototype ready by the time they get there. When the hell did she build that thing?
And also she comes up with a new part or improvement after every job they take. Seems like she had already build the parts before the movie even starts and now just slaps them together to test which combination of parts works the best. But that makes no sense, because they had not seen a ghost before they got to the mansion and had no measurements to base the tech on before.

I really like the new packs but to me it felt like they're developing too fast in a too short period of time.
Yeah I feel like they set up Holtzmann to be the Donatello of the group, where he would have a new machine built every episode because he's just that brilliant, lol. Holtzmann is that same kind of inexplicable child prodigy. Egon and Ray are more down to earth (not by much though, hehe).

Also, I get the impression they rushed through some beats in GB16 to avoid being redundant with GB84. They spent more time on scenes that were different (Erin worrying about ridicule, she and Abby fighting, etc).
By featofstrength
#4881202
JurorNo.2 wrote: Holtzmann is that same kind of inexplicable child prodigy. Egon and Ray are more down to earth (not by much though, hehe).
Maybe it's the beer she's missing with her Pringles?
Image
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By JurorNo.2
#4881204
featofstrength wrote:Maybe it's the beer she's missing with her Pringles?
Image
Yeah, back when Parental Guidance meant something, lol.
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By JurorNo.2
#4881223
savintheday wrote:'Member casual smoking?
Yeah, remember the second one where they did Ecstasy? ;)

Image
I'm surprised they aren't all vaping in the new one.
Oh man, that actually would have been perfect, lol. At least just Abby and Erin, they seem like they need the stress relief the most.
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By Sav C
#4881246
From the pics I've seen, the Mark II packs almost seem reminiscent of the original packs, I like the design quite a bit.

The Mark III is OK, I really like its thrower.
Last edited by Sav C on October 9th, 2016, 6:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
By Skyknight
#4881290
JurorNo.2 wrote:Yeah I feel like they set up Holtzmann to be the Donatello of the group, where he would have a new machine built every episode because he's just that brilliant, lol. Holtzmann is that same kind of inexplicable child prodigy. Egon and Ray are more down to earth (not by much though, hehe).
That doesn't really work for me. Even the most brilliant genius needs some time to actually get things done. Just having it ready without any building time feels like the whole thing was pre-built at a time where they couldn't have known that they'll need it. And that takes out a lot of the immersion for me! Then using it and having an instant upgrade ready when they get back to HQ makes it even worse! Too much, too fast, too rushed! I hope the extended cut will give her at least some days to actually work on the equipment, but I doubt it will!
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By Alphagaia
#4881299
I believe there is plenty of time for them to get the packs ready.

There are at least a few days between Eldridge and the second ghost encounter, with them uploading the film to ghostnews, it becoming a hit on Reddit, her Dean catching wind of this and her getting fired. The scenes in the movie follow each other because of comedic effect, but we can assume at least a day passes at minimum there. Then we have her going to Abby setting up a meeting with her dean and them getting fired and them looking for a new place.
Take note they steal a lot of stuff when they leave.
Setting a meeting with a realtor and visiting places takes a few days as well. Let's say three at the minimum.
Also take note the duffelbag Holtzmann takes with to the Eldridge mansion is the same as were the protongun emerges from in the second encounter and her mentioning Rowan using a cyclotron in his device but she prefers another kind of metal. Not sure which one. Mind is foggy here.
Lastly they have made an add, someone responded and made an appointment, and the stuff is in the restaurant with a working (seperate) phone for them. That takes time to set up.

So what does this say?

They already could have been working on a proton pack before Eldridge,it might be in the duffelbag, but even when it's not they at least get more information on how to build one after that encounter.
They already know that a cyclotron is crucial in ghostwrangling as Holzmann mentions Rowan uses one as well in his machine.
They take away a lot of stuff from Abbie's workplace, including the duffelbag, as we see in the subwayscene. It takes a few days to hire a apartment, getting the keys and contracts ready, etc. Ofcourse this is boring to witness so the movie skips over this, but it gives Holzmann ample time to build a first protonpack at her own place even if they had not started on it already.
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By zeta otaku
#4881304
The packs were also rush jobs with very little testing (hence Abby'so deflating balloon impression) and why we end up seeing 3 versions with a LOT of exposed components. If a sequel is ever made, I would think the mk 4s would be like the classic packs with a finished shell and maybe even taking a similar visual look to them as well.

All that being said, I really liked seeing the evolution of the technology
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By Skyknight
#4881490
I just think it would have been better to include a few scenes that suggest that a bit of time has passed, because without them the movie feels like it's taking no longer than a week from start to the final confrontation, with Rowan's plan already in full swing from the very beginning.

It takes less time to rent a place than it takes to buy one and much less time than getting a loan or mortgage from a bank!
And don't underestimate the internet. It can take less than a day for a video to go viral these days!

I also think there should have been some kind of mortage from ghostbusting jobs like in the old movies to suggest that more time has passed since the beginning and make the evolution of the technology more plausible. But they couldn't do that with the evil plan already running at full steam and the end result is that all of this tech evolution stuff feels unrealistic and forced into a too short period of time for me!

Taking the pack prototype out of the duffelbag at the subway station would've felt more realistic if they had mentioned they were working on something to catch ghosts by the time Erin comes to the others lab for the first time, right before they go to the mansion. Just one short line would've made it a little bit more believable. But they didn't! It's bad writing at its finest! I can't really put my finger on it, but the whole pace of the movie and how the events in it happen feels somehow off for me!
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By Alphagaia
#4881491
If you seriously think they upload a movie, which Erin's Dean watches after it going viral, them both losing their jobs, and them looking, finding and getting an apartment and moving in there all takes place in one day I don't think we will ever agree on this.
By pferreira1983
#4881520
scythemantis wrote:The only reason it failed was bitter fans and a lack of taste. It was fun, but everyone got hung up on their little baby fanboy problems.
Well buddy then I'm glad I have a lack of taste. Ha, ha! :mrgreen:
By ccv66
#4881527
Dont need bitter fans to fail your movie when you have trailers do it for you
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By JurorNo.2
#4881531
ccv66 wrote:Dont need bitter fans to fail your movie when you have trailers do it for you
Old news, a lot of fans I've seen on social media and IRL are planning to check it out now. It's kinda strange for any of us to bring up the trailer at this point. Same with Suicide Squad, people discuss this mythically amazing trailer more than the actual film. Part of that hype culture I guess.
By ccv66
#4881540
Well it was silly blame bitter fans for the lack of monetary success. When in reality upset fans probably wouldn't have changed box office that significantly
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By JurorNo.2
#4881544
ccv66 wrote:Well it was silly blame bitter fans for the lack of monetary success. When in reality upset fans probably wouldn't have changed box office that significantly
Fair enough.
By Skyknight
#4881549
Alphagaia wrote:If you seriously think they upload a movie, which Erin's Dean watches after it going viral, them both losing their jobs, and them looking, finding and getting an apartment and moving in there all takes place in one day I don't think we will ever agree on this.
Nah, not one in all day but three or four at max! They upload the video after they visited the mansion, let's say it goes viral the next day and the Dean sees it one or two days later, fires Erin and then she goes to the other two and asks for a job on the same day. Abby and Holtzmann take her to their Dean and he fires them because he didn't even know they were still working there. After that, they have no place to work on the pack and not time either, because they have all that looking for a new place and moving in stuff goin on. Leaves the two to three days before they were fired and that's definitely not enough time to build a pack! After that it feels like they go to a new sighting every day and have new improvements of the tech, also every day, or every other day at least. That feels way too fast, given that she also modifies the Ecto-1 in that time. It would work if it was explained that Rowan took a week or two for every one of his devices to build. But it wasn't and that way it looks like he has one ready every day to make it look like our heros are racing against the time.

It's just bad storytelling and a shame nobody noticed it while reading the script. Or even worse if they noticed it and didn't care because they thought the audience was dumb enough not to notice it!
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By Alphagaia
#4881550
Wait. First you said you would buy the prototype pack if they had a few days to create it:
Skyknight wrote: I hope the extended cut will give her at least some days to actually work on the equipment, but I doubt it will!
and now when I say logic dictates they had a few days (and nights) you say it's suddenly still not enough to produce an untested pack-on-wheels (which we don't know how hard it is to make) that shoots a protonstream?

We see Holtzmann present at Firehouse and when they go the Dean but's that's it. Still a lot of time to cobble something together that actually looks cobbled together.
They could make a montage ofcourse, but since it's all logical, why bother?

If you accept there are a few unseen days between them seeing their first ghost and the second ghost, you can also safely assume there is enough unseen time to cobble something together as well.

Just because the movie does not show you time skipping that is just logical to assume (as you already went from no time to a few days after I explained how things work) does not make it bad storywriting, that just on you not understanding between cuts time can be skipped to keep the movie flowing.
By Skyknight
#4881606
Alphagaia wrote:Just because the movie does not show you time skipping that is just logical to assume (as you already went from no time to a few days after I explained how things work) does not make it bad storywriting, that just on you not understanding between cuts time can be skipped to keep the movie flowing.
If it's not bad writing then it's bad cutting, because it's shown in a way that makes it seem like the scenes are happening very quickly after each other.
Look, I'm just not really good at explaining things, it just feels wrong to me! An extended cut might solve the problems I have with the overall pace of the movie, but only if they had scenes that show the passing of time much clearer that were left out in the theatrical version and are put back in for the extended!
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By Alphagaia
#4881607
Skyknight wrote:
Alphagaia wrote:Just because the movie does not show you time skipping that is just logical to assume (as you already went from no time to a few days after I explained how things work) does not make it bad storywriting, that just on you not understanding between cuts time can be skipped to keep the movie flowing.
If it's not bad writing then it's bad cutting, because it's shown in a way that makes it seem like the scenes are happening very quickly after each other.
Look, I'm just not really good at explaining things, it just feels wrong to me! An extended cut might solve the problems I have with the overall pace of the movie, but only if they had scenes that show the passing of time much clearer that were left out in the theatrical version and are put back in for the extended!
Erin and the others being shown in 4/5 different outfits in the different scenes between the two ghosts sightings also did not help you?

Or while Erin is unpacking and Holtzmann is dancing the protongun is in the foreground on the table being worked on: Image

Or Holtman working on a newer version and cutting wires before Kevin (or Heiss, I'm not sure) makes his appearance?

Image
There is so much evidence of timeskipping and Holtmann tinkering I'm afraid you just missed it or remembered wrong.
By Skyknight
#4881687
Alphagaia wrote:There is so much evidence of timeskipping and Holtmann tinkering I'm afraid you just missed it or remembered wrong.
That might be the case as I've only seen the movie on the internet because none of the theaters close to me showed it in 2D and I just hate watching 3D movies and not gonna watch it again before I can buy the DVD or BR!
Or maybe I just took it for the old "women changing their clothes 3 times a day" cliché, because that is what many of the women in movies(and some in rl) do!
Or I was too distracted by Holtzmann being Holtzmann to pay attention what else was going on in the scenes :mrgreen:
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By Alphagaia
#4881688
Well, it's another case of someone seeing a pirated copy, missed out on details because of poor visual quality and falsely faults the movie for it, but thanks for admitting your mistake!

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